How do you trust God when suffering doesn't end? Pastor Shane Colwell knows this question intimately. For more than a decade, he and his family have cared for their son Chase, who lives with profound medical challenges, daily seizures, and ongoing uncertainty. Through years of hardship, Shane has discovered that God's faithfulness is often found not in immediate healing, but in His sustaining presence.
How do you trust God when suffering doesn't end?
Pastor Shane Colwell knows this question intimately. For more than a decade, he and his family have cared for their son Chase, who lives with profound medical challenges, daily seizures, and ongoing uncertainty. Through years of hardship, Shane has discovered that God's faithfulness is often found not in immediate healing, but in His sustaining presence.
In this deeply practical and biblically rich conversation, Pastor Shane answers some of the most difficult questions Christians ask about suffering. Together, he and Stephanie discuss lament, unanswered prayers, chronic illness, disability, grief, marriage, community, and how to cling to God's character when life doesn't make sense.
Whether you're navigating disability, caregiving, chronic pain, or a season of unanswered questions, this episode offers compassionate encouragement and biblical hope for every believer.
KEY QUESTIONS:
KEY SCRIPTURES:
Stephanie Daniels:
Welcome back to the podcast. Today's conversation is a gentle one because we're stepping into something we all experience but don't always know how to talk about: pain. Whether it's physical, emotional, or the kind that lingers quietly beneath the surface, hurt has a way of shaping our stories. I'm so honored to be joined today by Pastor Shane Colwell, author of I Know It Hurts.
In this conversation, we're not rushing past the hard or tying it up with easy answers. We're making space to be honest about it and discover how God meets us right in the middle of our suffering.
If you're walking through disability, hardship, or a season that feels especially heavy, I hope this episode reminds you that you are not alone and your pain is seen. Let's lean in together. Welcome to the podcast, Shane.
Pastor Shane Colwell: Stephanie.
It's, great to be with you today.
Stephanie Daniels:
We're so glad you're here. And, to get started, for those who may not know you, can you tell us a bit about yourself and your family? And then tell us what led you to write your book, I Know It Hurts.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I've been the pastor of Grace Bible Church in Barrington, New Jersey for almost seven years now. And, for the seven years before that, I was the founding lead pastor, church-planter of a church in Worcester, Massachusetts called, The Church on Seven Hills, which I started right out of seminary.
Both of my children were born while we were serving in Worcester. My oldest son Nathan is 12, and then my youngest son Chase, will be 10 He is a blessing to our family. And Chase has very severe special needs. Has a severe brain malformation called polymicrogyria, which means many small folds in the brain. He has the worst case of it. It's, uh, generalized, so it's throughout the entire brain. It's not localized.
Stephanie Daniels:
Hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
With that comes, cerebral palsy, laryngomalacia, Lennox-Gastaut syndrome, daily seizures, many, many overnight typically. You know, he can't really move much, can't communicate a whole lot except for with his eyes and his smile. He's very medically fragile.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so it's been, uh, a time of blessing for us in our family over these past 10 years. We can honestly say that God has just been faithful, and He's blessed us, but it's been through hardship, tremendous hardship, in watching our son suffer, going through suffering as a family...
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And learning that I'm not in control of everything and I can't fix what ails my child. Out of that, the Lord has brought tremendous ministry opportunities with the special needs community, with those with disabilities, those that are hurting. The old adage is true that, people don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care. And I would add to that also, they know that you've lived it.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And it's not to say that we can't ever speak into things that we haven't first lived, but I think that it is incredibly helpful. Especially with these communities that often feel as though they're not understood, and they're not cared for.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so being able to empathize on some level has been tremendously helpful and God has opened up a lot of doors. And so through all of that, began to think, maybe God could use Chase's story. I mean, He's done that tremendously over the years, but maybe through open and honestly sharing what our family's been through, and then what the Lord has taught us in the midst of that, was really the impetus behind starting to write the book.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
It's a short read. It's only 132 pages, but it's very personal. It's all about Chase and our family and what God has showed us through that, and then sort of some biblical principles and helpful encouragements to people that are enduring similar trials.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. Amen. It is full of, really great principles. I was really encouraged by what I read. And just I love how you explain things What part, and you kind of already answered this, but what part of your own story most shaped this message?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I would say as the author, mostly what God has done in me. Though God has not healed Chase, Chase has gotten worse. but God has been faithful, just faithful over and over and over again. Not only in sparing Chase's life, he should not be alive.
Stephanie Daniels:
Wow.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
If you read the book, he's been intubated. He's been in a coma. He had COVID and double pneumonia and, and should not be alive. God has spared his life. And then also just what God has shown me in growing my faith and my understanding of who He is. What He does promise and what He does not promise, and then being able to, in a very real way, feel what it means for God's mercies to truly be new every morning. You know, they're enough for today. They might not be enough for 10 years down the road, but He'll supply at that time.
Stephanie Daniels:
Amen.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
So just what God has taught me through this , and my family, my wife, my oldest son. I go into some of what God has taught them and how God has sustained them and blessed them as well. But, really just my own journey with the Lord...
Stephanie Daniels:
Beautiful.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Over these past 10 years.
Stephanie Daniels:
Wow. I love that. I do encourage our listeners to grab a copy, and we'll link that in our show notes so you guys can get your own copy and just be encouraged by Shane's story.
Well, Shane, we took a little liberty, knowing that you would be on the podcast, and we asked our listeners and social media followers: what they wished their pastor would say about suffering. And we're so grateful to get to ask you some of those questions because suffering is one of those more ambiguous, touchy, weighty wonderings in the Christian walk.
And so I'm wondering, would you come alongside us today and share some biblical truths?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Absolutely.
Stephanie Daniels:
Okay.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I'll do my best.
Stephanie Daniels:
Well, I'm really excited to get into this. One of the first questions we got is, how can I have a deeper intimacy with God to have an authentic testimony and stronger hope?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah, that's a great question. And it's very practical. A lot of times we speak about suffering in ways that are theoretical or theological, but not necessarily practical.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I actually just finished a book in which several chapters will be dedicated to not only a theological foundation and a theological answering of suffering, but also practical, answerings on suffering and then steps as well.
One thing that I found helpful is that a great preacher I heard in seminary, while he was preaching on James chapter 1, he said, "Trials are like trails. They can either lead you closer to Jesus or farther away."
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And to me, that is foundational. When it comes to having a deeper intimacy with the Lord, in the midst of trials, where do you take your trials?
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Because fight or flight is real. And it's real when deep suffering occurs. We can run toward Christ for comfort and strength and truth, or we can run away and isolate. To me, step one in a deeper intimacy with the Lord in the midst of trials is going to Him, and going to Him and being honest.
Not sugarcoating suffering, God doesn't sugarcoat suffering throughout scripture. We see honest lament. We see Jeremiah, who's a weeping prophet. We see Job, who suffers tremendously and is very raw in the midst of that.
We see examples in the New Testament with the Apostle Paul and the thorn in the flesh. And so, suffering is real and we have recorded prayers of people that love the Lord and were mature believers-
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm ...
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Who went to the Lord and went to Him honestly.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I think it's so important that we free ourselves from this unbiblical and unrealistic expectation that Christians shouldn't grieve...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Shouldn't be sad. We don't see a rejection of sadness and tears and grief in scripture. We see all of those things present. The difference between the believer and the unbeliever is we know where to take those.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yes.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And we take them to the Lord. And so I think that's so important. And then third, do your best to commune with the Lord even in small ways and be consistent. That's one of those things that is so hard in the midst of suffering because the last thing that you wanna do is be consistent in anything.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
You might just wanna crawl into a hole. You might just wanna sleep. You might just wanna isolate or just veg out in front of the television. And I notice in my own life that just small acts of faithfulness often grow deep roots. The importance is consistency, not necessarily how polished or good the substance looks.
Stephanie Daniels:
That's so good ...
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so sit with one or two verses, worship even when you might not feel like it...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah ...
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Pray short prayers that feel a little more manageable and might even be raw, but do it often and consistently. That's what I really try to encourage people is, in those moments, don't worry about how great it looks.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Just be consistent and see how the Lord grows in the midst of that.
Stephanie Daniels:
I'm so excited for this podcast because I love practical tips and you just gave us several right there.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah, well, I have a couple more if that's okay. Is that okay?
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah, absolutely. It's so good, keep going.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
One of the things that I realized, not only in, my own suffering and grief but also in the more that I I studied scripture and sort of made this one of the areas of my theology that I really studied deeply is how, oftentimes, it's good to pray for relief and deliverance and healing. We should do that.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
But it's interesting, our immediate desire is relief and not necessarily understanding what God might be doing through this.
Stephanie Daniels:
Right.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Right? When I finally got that, my prayers started to shift from, "Lord, just remove this immediately" to, "Lord, what are you trying to teach me in the midst of this?"
"Lord, what are you forming in me? How are you gonna use this for your glory?" It's not that those other prayers ever go away. They remain. But we allow more of a focus on what God is trying to form in us. Instead of just relief, begin to ask what God is forming.
Stephanie Daniels:
That's so good. And also what I'm hearing in what you're sharing is that lament is okay.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Oh, yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
It's okay to lament.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah. About 40% of the Psalms are actually laments.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
It starts with crying out to God, bringing the request to the Lord, and it ends in hope and rejoicing. It's interesting that most of the time it's not rejoicing that the suffering had been removed. It's rejoicing over what the Lord is doing in the midst of that suffering.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so, yeah, lament is not a faithless response. Lament assumes that God can do the miraculous. It assumes that God is all-powerful and it assumes that He is all good. And so that's why we are going to Him saying, "Lord, this doesn't make sense...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Because this is what I know about you." It's a faithful response. Instead of crying out elsewhere, you're taking that to the Lord. And so I really encourage people lamenting is a part of hope. It is not a hopeless response.
Stephanie Daniels:
That's beautiful.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
That is something I've always thought. Like, how is lamenting okay? How is that different from complaining or grumbling, which is never a posture that we wanna take to Him.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Absolutely.
Stephanie Daniels:
I love that that lament is a- It's like a hopeful cry out to the Lord.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
It is.
Stephanie Daniels:
That's beautiful.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
It is.
Stephanie Daniels:
Thank you for sharing that.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah. The person asked about testimony-
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah ...
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I think, in the question.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm. how do I have the authentic testimony? Yes.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
One of the things is testimony is not just about deliverance or victory, but also what God taught you in the midst of that. Because let's be honest, most of the time deliverance from suffering doesn't happen immediately and it may not even happen in this life. So what encouragement can we offer to those that are having chronic suffering?
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Ongoing, God isn't removing it. And that testimony can be, well, how was God faithful? How did He bring you through? How are His mercies new every morning? And so, I wanna encourage people that might not have this tremendous, victorious story, God can use that testimony in tremendous ways if you just share what God taught you and how He ministered to you.
Stephanie Daniels:
I feel like you're describing our founder, Joni Eareckson Tada.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
She's an inspiration to me.
Stephanie Daniels:
Absolutely. She's, still walking out her testimony, but she's giving glory to the Lord, right?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
She's amazing.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. Well, how is suffering part of God's plan to refine us?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
That's a great question. And the New Testament really does make it clear. The first thing is, is that all suffering is purposeful. God is doing something, right?
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
There is no suffering that's meaningless. and in the case of refining us, we see several, scripture passages on that. The big one is probably 1 Peter 1:6-7, which says, "In this you rejoice, though now for a little while, if necessary, you have been grieved by various trials, so that the tested genuineness of your faith, more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Christ." There's a few things here that I just wanna highlight briefly. The first thing is that, though it can be hard to understand, and it's still hard for me to understand, we can rejoice in the midst of suffering.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
It's really hard. It might not come quickly.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
But Peter shows us that suffering and joy can coexist, as difficult as that really is. We need to be very careful in how we communicate that to people. We don't wanna come across as calloused. "Well, you know, you just need to be joyful." "Well, wait a second. I'm suffering really bad, and it hurts." And so we don't wanna be callous, but we also don't wanna deny biblical truths.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
We wanna uphold both: suffering is real it hurts. Even in the midst of that, we can have a Spirit-induced joy. Yeah. And then Peter says that suffering can act like a refiner's fire, and basically what that means is that when you take precious metals and you heat them up, if it is genuine, it doesn't destroy the metal. What it does is it strips the impurities. And so it has a two-pronged effect. The first thing is it exposes, what is not genuine. It'll destroy that. And so, trials often expose whether or not we've built on the right foundation: repentance and faith in the Lord Jesus. That's the first thing that it does. And then for the believer, what it does is it begins to, over time, strip away those impurities-
Stephanie Daniels:
Hmm
Pastor Shane Colwell:
In our lives and, in our faith. It doesn't mean that our faith is not a saving faith. It is. But it means that God is using those trials to heat us up and form some of what is lacking maybe in our character, maybe in our understanding of who Christ is, maybe in our daily walk, maybe on some faulty assumptions.
Give you one example. One of the things that God stripped away from me was my false sense of control. I'm very systematic. I'm a planner. and my plan for Chase might've looked a certain way. And God showed up and showed me I have next to zero control over what happens in Chase's life as far as many things go.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
My plan for Chase was not God's plan, and God's plan wins.
Stephanie Daniels:
Hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And it began to strip away that false sense of being in control, and then it drove me into dependence on the Lord and His control. Those are the ways that suffering can be refining.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
It's difficult. It can be painful. But it ultimately grows and begins to shape us.
Stephanie Daniels:
I just love the way you explained that. I'm curious, should people be afraid of suffering?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Great question. I would say no in the sense of we don't wanna fear that which God has promised us. In this life, you will have trials.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
It might show up in a multitude of ways. But, I think that I would be fearful if I didn't have the promises of God, I didn't have His Word, I didn't have His faithful presence.
Stephanie Daniels:
That's so good.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so as an unbeliever, I would be fearful of trials because everything's built on me and what I can do and I can manage.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
As a believer, I don't think we should fear trials. We should recognize they are real and they are painful. And they are often, and this might sound counterintuitive but let me explain, they are often greater than we can handle. The cliche that is thrown around constantly in regards to suffering is that God will never give you more than you can handle.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
When God says that He will never give you more than you can handle, He's speaking of temptation, and that which He will make a way of escape. He will not give a temptation that is not common to man, but He will create a way of escape.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
He doesn't say that in regards to suffering.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
We often get more than we can handle, and that's why we need Christ. That's why we have the power of the Holy Spirit in us. That's why we have His Word. That's why we can go before the Lord, directly and take our supplications and our prayers and our cries to Him.
Stephanie Daniels:
So good. Another question we got was, what does it look like to trust God when you're suffering greatly and healing doesn't come the way you hoped?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I have been there. Healing has not come, to my son in 10 years, and there's not a documented case of healing for this ailment.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
It'll likely have a devastating effect on my son for the rest of his earthly life. And so I understand this, and it is one that can seem easy to answer theologically, but really hard to live and experience practically.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so once again, this is not easy, and we should not pretend it is. I always caution people, and I've become far more cautioned- As a pastor and just as a friend, now that I've walked the road of suffering... on what I do and do not say. Your friends that are suffering don't need platitudes, especially when it's chronic suffering. They don't need you to take scripture out of context and just...
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Sort of, beat them over the head with one-liners. And so, I encourage people not to try to force people immediately to the positive side. Let them grieve and lament and go through all of those things. Over 10 years of suffering that has not gone away, here's what I have found really helpful, and here's what I've learned. The first thing is that Suffering puts a laser focus on one issue in our life that is overriding that is painful. And it narrows our vision of God and who He is and His goodness down to whether or not He brings immediate relief of that suffering, Does that make sense?
Stephanie Daniels:
Yes, it does.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so, when we don't have all the answers to these difficult questions as to why this remains, why God allowed it, what we have to do is we have to cling to what we know.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And that is we know the character of God. We know that He is gracious. We know that He is good. We know that He is loving. We know that He is merciful. We know that He is sovereign, right?
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so we trust in His character. When we don't have all the answers, we cling to what we do know.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
We also trust in His track record, and so we remember our salvation. we remember all the ways that He blessed us and even one blessing of the Lord is unmerited favor to sinners. And so as believers, we need to remember God's track record in sustaining us and blessing us over and over again while we were yet sinners, while we didn't deserve any of it.
When I cling to that, that allows me to expand my view beyond just my suffering and also expand my view of who God is. He's not just the God who did or did not remove the suffering. He's the God who is good. He's the God who saved me, And so it expands my vision of who God is. And you also have to focus on His promises, That He will never leave you nor forsake you as a believer. Revelation 1:4, that one day, we can take it to the bank, He will return. He will restore all things. And Revelation 21 says that He will literally wipe away every single tear from our eyes. Those are promises that I can know, that I can believe whether or not God immediately removes this suffering or not. When we don't have answers of those things that we just don't understand.
Stephanie Daniels:
I love that, just remembering God's track record. And, I never thought of- And I should have. I never thought of unmerited favor being a blessing. I don't know why I expect that, and I shouldn't because it's- Yeah ... undeserved.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Everything's grace, right?
Stephanie Daniels:
Right.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Right.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yes.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
It's...
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Absolutely.
Stephanie Daniels:
Undeserved, and that is such a blessing. I'm thankful for that reminder today.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Me too.
Stephanie Daniels:
Another question we got: What are practical ways to biblically suffer together in marriage ,family, in community? And then maybe if you could, how do you...
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
Suffer well when you're alone?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah. That's a great question, and that's... one of the hardest things that I've had to learn, because that's inherently practical. You're all suffering in the same household.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yes.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
For my wife and for my boys. I talked about this quite a bit in the book because it's so real, and suffering, let's be honest, doesn't just have an individually devastating effect.
It can, if we're not careful, have a devastating effect on the family. And so I just wanted to share a couple things that I've learned , that have been helpful. And I wholeheartedly admit that some of this I learned through error, not necessarily through getting it all right in the moment.
Stephanie Daniels:
MmHm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
The first thing is, you have to recognize that people suffer and deal with suffering differently. You may be one. And we are, right? With our spouse, we are one. But, we still have separate personalities.
Stephanie Daniels:
Right.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
We still process differently.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I tend to be a " closed shut," internalize... and process. I'm- kinda stoic and quiet. , And my wife just wears it all on her sleeve. And so we grieved differently.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I got through it a little bit quicker, whereas she lamented a little bit longer. There is no right or wrong approach, and, one of the things we have to realize, especially as men, when we have children that are suffering, is chances are your wife is bearing the brunt of that on a daily basis. I get to escape and go to work. She's the primary caregiver other than our nurses.
And so she wears that constantly. So we had to be okay with, me saying, "Hey, I'm just gonna support my wife and love her and try to understand." And she had to come to realize that my quietness or my demeanor didn't mean that I didn't care.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so we had to learn to love each other and allow each other the space to go about this with the Lord differently. And then debrief and talk together about what we're learning and, and those kinds of things.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And then the second thing was, realizing that in the midst of suffering, it's very easy to turn against one another. And instead of making, whatever it is you're going through, that which that you're going through together, you make it that which tears you apart. One of our friends said to us, Your spouse is not the enemy. The enemy is the enemy," right? Satan is the enemy. Your spouse is not the enemy, they're your partner. They're going through the same thing. They're trying to process it, and you're in partnership with one another. You're not in competition or against one another.
And so, I found that tremendously important. And then also, we need Christ as a family, praying together, going before the Lord with your wife, with your kids, with your spouse, with your extended family member is essential. And then going through it together as a biblical community as well is incredibly important.
A lot of folks, when they're suffering, they run from the church. You know, you don't see 'em for a while or whatever. The opposite should be the right response, and that is that we run to the body of Christ. We cast our cares upon the Lord and upon each other.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
That we might bear one another's burdens, right? Galatians chapter six, I believe. The body of Christ has been just a tremendous blessing to our family. so I, I encourage people to be in biblical community. You never need it more than when you are suffering.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And then as a single person, it's really, really difficult. How do you suffer alone? I think the goal should be not to suffer alone.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Now, you might not have a spouse. You might not have as many extended family members, whatever it is, but you can find a biblical community. Christian friends that will support you and pray for you and, love you.
I'd encourage people, even as singles to surround yourself with a biblical community. None of us are called to be lone rangers for Christ. None of us are called to be lone rangers in our suffering. We've been saved into the body of Christ, and so let the body of Christ minister.
We're all gonna have times when we're alone. And I think when we're alone, we gotta be very careful not to allow Satan a foothold into our lives. He is the accuser. He is gonna bring thoughts into our minds that "God is mad at you." "Maybe you deserve this." "What have you done wrong?" We need to be diligent in communing with the Lord in prayer, in His Word, and, rejecting the lies of Satan with biblical truth.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. that's so, so critical. We do need community and a body of believers that are gonna help encourage us. That's so good. Okay. Well, along with questions, our listeners and followers shared some statements of belief that their lives have taught them. I'm wondering if you would lend your discernment to these.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Sure.
Stephanie Daniels:
You just let us know, true or false, and if you've got explanation for it.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Absolutely.
Stephanie Daniels:
Finding joy in walking through suffering doesn't mean the pain goes away.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Hmm. Absolutely true. Yeah, it does not go away, especially when we're talking about chronic suffering. And for a biblical example, we need to look no further than the Apostle Paul. 2 Corinthians: 12 speaks of this very issue, and that is that Paul had what he called a "thorn in the flesh."
"A messenger of Satan that visited him," as he said. And it's interesting- He notes that in this case, the Lord sent it to him so that he would not become conceited.
We don't always know exactly why God allows us to go through suffering. We don't, have a, clear answer like Paul all the time. But what Paul says specifically is that he asked the Lord three times, he pleaded with the Lord, that he would take it away, and God instead said, "My grace is sufficient for you...
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
For my power is made perfect in your weakness." God did not take the suffering away, but God supplied him the strength needed and the grace needed in the midst of that suffering to endure it to the point of where Paul was joyful and said, "Then I will boast in my suffering."
Stephanie Daniels:
Hm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Paul found joy even with the thorn in the flesh that he pleaded with the Lord to leave, and God did not, take it away, but He taught him and He gave him all of the necessities to endure it and to endure it with joy. And so I absolutely agree with that first statement.
Stephanie Daniels:
Can I ask where is God when the pain doesn't go away?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Well, the good news is for the believer, He's right there with you. He was in the pit with Joseph in the Old Testament.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
He's in the valley of the shadow of death in Psalm chapter 23. He was there weeping with Mary and Martha in John 11.
Stephanie Daniels:
Come on. Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
He was with Job in the midst of his despair. He's with you and I.
Stephanie Daniels:
Amen.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
He will never leave us nor forsake us. And we don't have a Savior who reigns on high. We see time and time again He gets down in the pit of despair with us. And so times when we suffer, when we might feel that God is far, I'd remind you He's never been more near.
Stephanie Daniels:
That's scriptural. The Lord is near to the broken-hearted.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Amen.
Stephanie Daniels:
Okay, our next one: God will not heal you even if you desperately need it. You will suffer in this life.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I would say that question needs more context, I think.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Um, it's a really tough statement- that statement needs a little more explanation. And so let me try to address both parts of it, if that's all right. God does bring spiritual healing to all of us who repent and believe in the Gospel. The healing that we need most greatly is spiritual, not physical.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord Jesus will be saved. He will make us new. He'll indwell His Holy Spirit with us, and He secures our eternity in heaven. All of us can receive the ultimate healing that we need, which is spiritual.
Now, when it comes to physical, God may heal or He may not, and we don't always have the answer as to the why or the when. We do know that he is the Great Physician and that he heals even today, and so God may heal. We've seen amazing healings that doctors can't explain, and we believe divine healing. But there's also times when God doesn't heal.
Stephanie Daniels:
Right.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And in those times, what I think is important for us to understand is what God promises and what God doesn't promise. He does not promise that physical healing will always come in this life. What He does promise is His presence. What He does promise is His faithfulness. What He does promise is both things for today and things in the future: our eternal healing and restoration. He may bring healing, but He always brings his faithfulness.
Stephanie Daniels:
Wow. We see this all the time people remind us of this or if Joni is talking about healing, or people wanna share their thoughts on her condition, you know, they'll say, "Well, you're not believing right," or, "You're not, strong in your faith," Jesus healed them all.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah. I would say respectfully that's false. We have biblical examples, in John chapter five when Jesus goes to the pool at Bethesda. It says that, that pool was, supposedly a healing pool. That was the belief. When the waters would stir, they would try to get into the pool. Well, there were many laying around the pool. The text does not say that Jesus went around healing all of them. He fixed his eyes on one man and healed him, and there's no evidence that He healed anybody else that day.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Jesus did not heal everyone. In John chapter 11, though he did raise Lazarus from the dead, He basically ignored the inquiries of Mary and Martha, who were asking the Lord to come to Bethany. And John says, "Now Jesus loved Mary, He loved Martha, and He loved Lazarus, so he stayed where he was an extra few days." And didn't come.
Stephanie Daniels:
Right.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
He let Lazarus die. Now, He did raise him, for a specific reason in the end, but Lazarus still died again.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yes.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
That's another example where healing didn't come. And then Paul is probably one of the biggest examples. Godly man, serving the Lord, doing amazing things. Do we want to say that we had greater faith than Paul and what he endured?
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And how faithfully he shared the Gospel? And yet he had a debilitating, which I believe was probably a physical ailment. We don't know exactly, but I'm on the side of scholars that believe it was probably some sort of physical ailment He pleaded with the Lord three times, and the Lord basically said, "No."
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
"I'm not healing you. I'm gonna sustain you." And so, I would say that that statement is false, and I think it's a little dangerous.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah, It is so dangerous. Joni has so much experience with all of that. And...
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I'm sure ...
Stephanie Daniels:
I love that, when people ask if they can pray for Joni, she says, " Yes, you can. Would you pray for me that I don't walk in pride, and pray that I would be sensitive to the Lord and His leading" and I love that because she's come to a place in her own heart where she, like you said, she wants the spiritual healing more than she wants...
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
Physical healing.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And look at what God has done...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yes.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Through her. God, in His providence chose not to bring full healing for her. I, I know through her story that she has suffered in daily pain. When you think about the ways that God has used her because of her faithfulness, it's overwhelming.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. So, so true. I'll do this one as our last true/false. God makes us suffer because He's sometimes mad at us.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
So what I would say is, that can be both true and false, and let me explain.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
There are limited biblical examples, there's a lot in the Old Testament, there are limited New Testament examples where suffering can be as a result of sin. One is in, 1 Corinthians 11 in which, Paul says that because people were taking communion in an irreverent manner, they were getting sick at the Lord's table. There's an element in which God is bringing sickness and judgment because of their irreverence and their sin. And then probably the biggest example in the New Testament, and the most extreme, is Ananias and Sapphira.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Because of their lies, God struck them dead. Could it be that God is using a trial, is using a suffering to really get ahold of us and pull us out of our sin? It could be.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
What I would say is that most often it is not judgment, it is correction. We think about refining. God is stripping those impurities, right? But most of the time, I would also say, it is not a result of sinfulness. We only have to look at the 12 apostles. Those guys were serving the Lord faithfully. They turned into amazing witnesses for the Lord Jesus. 11 out of the 12 of them were martyred for their faith.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Many of them in awful ways.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And the only one who wasn't was John, who the early church fathers say was boiled in oil...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And sent into isolation. So he didn't go unscathed either. And then the Apostle Paul endured tremendous suffering. And so, suffering most often is not a result of God being mad at us. Oftentimes it's just simply a result of living in a sinful and decaying world in which sickness and trial exist.
Stephanie Daniels:
I feel like I could just sit with you forever and just ask you questions. This has been so great. As an encouragement, would you share with us, what would you say to someone who feels like their pain is too much or not valid enough? We hear from friends of the ministry who ask for prayer even though, apologetically, they're saying, their suffering isn't as bad as Joni's. So what would you say to someone who feels like their pain is too much or not valid enough?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Let me start with those that feel as though it's not valid. Yes, most of us will not suffer to the extent that Joni has for over 50 years...
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm
Pastor Shane Colwell:
In a daily way. Many of us will not suffer at that degree. But I would say that all suffering is valid. I've had people come to me like, " Well, you got enough to worry about, you know? You don't need my prayer requests," or whatever. And I'm like, "Look, just because I have a child who suffers on a daily basis doesn't mean that what you're going through right now isn't real."
Stephanie Daniels:
Right.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Right? And it doesn't mean that I don't care. Sometimes to hear stories about what others are going through is helpful to put our own suffering in perspective. God may use that, to say, "Hey, overall you've got it pretty good," and that can be helpful. But God can use any level of suffering not only to teach us, and form us in the way that He wants to form us, but also to minister to other people. You might be suffering with something that you might feel is small, but it's something that maybe I haven't suffered with. So you can speak to people about that issue that I can't.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Or you can speak more effectively. And so God can redeem and use as a platform any level of suffering for His glory.
Stephanie Daniels:
Amen. That's great.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And then to those that feel like it's too much, I would just refer you back to what I said before. It often is too much, and that's why we need Christ, and that's why we need the body of Christ. I would encourage those who feel that it's overwhelming to recognize it is, and that's why God will never leave you nor forsake you.
Stephanie Daniels:
Amen.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
That's why He's given you His Word, that's why He's given you the power of the Holy Spirit in you, and that's why He's given you the body of Christ.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Oftentimes God blesses and He cares for us through His people. And so if you're not with His people, you're missing out on some of that care and blessing.
Stephanie Daniels:
Hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
At my church they've been tremendous. The body of Christ has just poured out God's blessing on us. And so you're right. It is more than you can handle, and that's why God has given you Himself and His people.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. How do you deal with the exhaustion of suffering, not just physically, but emotionally and spiritually?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Don't sacrifice yourself on the altar of serving or on the altar of always doing things for others.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
There has to be a level of self-care. That's not selfishness. I need to make time to commune with the Lord.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
I need to make time to sleep. I need to make time to be with other people that can encourage me. Being willing to say, "I need help and I need time to do that," has been something I've had to learn. 'Cause I'm always the guy that, "Yeah, no problem, I'll take care of that," or, "I'll, I'll do that" or...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And the last thing I'll do is worry about myself.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And that's given me health problems. Just the wear and the tear and the stress on that. And so being willing to say, "Hey, this is what I think I need, and this is what the Lord has shown me that I need, and I'm gonna be diligent in doing this-
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah ...
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And taking the time for it,"
Stephanie Daniels:
Permission to step back and rest.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
How do we talk about hope without offering Christian cliches?
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Oh, man. Yeah. that's a tremendous question. So many of us, we do one of two things. We're either too scared to do anything, or we're too confident in what we know, and we just start talking nonsense to people that are suffering.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And I think that, far too often we end up in those one extremes. We don't know what to say, so we say nothing, and we do nothing, or we think we know what to say, so we just hit people with all kind of things, the Christian cliches and the platitudes that have no spiritual depth to them whatsoever.
One thing that I think is incredibly important for us to realize is that suffering is weighty, it's difficult, it's painful, it's hurtful. One of the best ways that you can serve other people who are suffering is not necessarily first with your words, it's with your presence. Hug a neck, hold a hand, and just sit, and just be there.
In the Book of Job, Job's friends did a lot wrong. They get one thing right. When tragedy strikes, Job's friends go, and they sit with him in the dirt for days, and they don't say a word because quiet presence recognizes the weight of the despair. The despair is so deep and so difficult that the only proper response is silence and contemplation of the depths.
One of the best ways that you can encourage people that are suffering, and maybe even get to be able to share a message with hope, is to first sit and just be there and be quiet and just be a support. That would be advice number one that I would share with people. Slow to speak...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yes.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Quick to be present...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
If that's what the person desires. And then also, the more that I study and the more that I, I do in this and I write on this, and I develop a theology of suffering, the more I realize I don't know.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And so therefore, I become even more comfortable with, telling people, "I don't know why God has allowed this in your life. I don't know what He might be doing in the midst of this, but here's what I do know." And then I can remind people about biblical truth, about who God is...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
About how He loves us. God may give you an opportunity to speak truth and hope into people's lives, but do so with great humility. And do so with a very modest understanding of what you actually do know and do not know about what they're enduring. And then when God gives you an opportunity to speak, Speak hope, but speak carefully.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
And then third, we must understand that Christian hope is not confidence that things will immediately improve. It is confidence that what ails us now does not have final say.
And so, how do we talk about hope in the midst of suffering? We don't always talk about hope that this will end tomorrow. It's hope that one day, God will restore all things. It's hope in the future promises of God. That's really what Christian hope is, is that all of these things, though they're painful, though they may last for a time, they are not eternal.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Our salvation and our being with Christ, and the fact that He will wipe away every tear, that's what is eternal.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. Shane, this has been so beautiful. Really encouraging, I feel like you've, put a spotlight on practical answers for us in the midst of our suffering. And I'm just wondering, if you would close us in prayer and pray for those who find themselves suffering right now.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Absolutely.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
We'd love that.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
Let's pray. Gracious Heavenly Father, I pray that You will be near to those that are hurting. Lord, we know that You are near to the brokenhearted, Father, and I pray that You would make Your presence known. Lord, I pray that You will sit with them in their grief, that You would hold them in their pain, and that, Lord, You would remind them of Your constant, steadfast love. And Lord, that You would carry them through those moments that they feel are too overwhelming. Lord, please comfort the hearts today, quiet their fearful thoughts, and remind them that You are in the valleys of despair with them. And Lord, I pray that, You would remind us all that You walk with us in our pain and in our suffering. I pray that You would give those that are suffering today strength for today and new mercies tomorrow For great is Your faithfulness. Lord, I pray that Your promises would be real in our hearts today, and that they would sustain us. In the name of Your Son, Jesus Christ, our Savior. Amen.
Stephanie Daniels:
Amen. How can our listeners connect with you and your book? You can connect with me on ShaneColwellMinistries.com. my books are on there. My blog is on there- and that blog will be centered a lot around the things that we just talked about. Yeah.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
It'll be centered around grief and suffering and trying to walk with people through that. That might be something that could be encouraging...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yes.
Pastor Shane Colwell:
To people in the audience that it'll be an ongoing thing. It's not like I'm just gonna answer it for one week. It'll be a thing in which I try to deal with all the pieces, not only what God has taught me, but also, what His Word says and what I've learned through experience.
And then also, you can find me on Facebook, my handle is just Shane Colwell Ministries. Then if you also wanna follow my son Chase and just kinda his journey you can look up Team Chase on Facebook. You can read about his journey and just sorta walk with our family through that.
Stephanie Daniels:
Awesome. Well, we will be sure to put all of your contact and your websites, in our show notes so our listeners can find you. And listener, I hope you feel a little bit more seen, a little less alone, and that you're reminded that even in the midst of deep pain, God is near.
So until next time, may you find moments of rest glimpses of hope and the steady presence of God right in the middle of it all. And make sure you follow us on social media if you have questions or topics that you'd like us to include in our conversations with, guests in the future. God bless you.
We hope this conversation touched your heart today. If it did, consider sharing it with someone who might be encouraged as well. And don’t forget to follow us on your favorite podcasting app so you never miss an episode. See you next week!
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