Army Chaplain and special needs dad Matt McCraney joins Stephanie Daniels to talk about how the body of Christ can better embrace people living with disabilities. Bringing personal, biblical, and academic perspectives, Matt identifies barriers that keep disabled people from finding their places of belonging in the church and he offers practical ways Christians can better demonstrate the love of Jesus to those living with disability.
Army Chaplain and special needs dad Matt McCraney joins Stephanie Daniels to talk about how the body of Christ can better embrace people living with disabilities. Bringing personal, biblical, and academic perspectives, Matt identifies barriers that keep disabled people from finding their places of belonging in the church and he offers practical ways Christians can better demonstrate the love of Jesus to those living with disability.
Matt McCraney has served as an Army Chaplain for 17 years and is a devoted father to a child with autism. He holds a PhD from Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary and a Doctor of Ministry degree from Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary. Married to his wife Sarah for 20 years, Matt is the proud father of four children and the owner of a beloved dog named Appa.
As Matt says: “Sundays are incredibly difficult for families with a disabled child, often because of the attitudes and assumptions of members. To welcome these families, we need to reexamine how we understand disability and bring our thinking in line with the Bible on this critical issue.”
Read Matt’s articles:
More than Bodies: Examining our Assumptions about Disability
Faith on the Spectrum: Reimagining Discipleship Expectations for Children with Autism
KEY QUESTIONS:
KEY SCRIPTURES:
Stephanie Daniels:
Hi friends! I’m your host, Stephanie Daniels, and you’re listening to the Joni and Friends Ministry Podcast. We’re sharing hope as we answer real questions about disability. Join us every week for an honest and encouraging conversation, along with practical ways to include people with disability in your church and community. So, grab a seat, and let’s jump in!
Matt McCraney is a pastor turned army chaplain. After years pastoring in youth ministry, he began pastoring military families and fell in love with ministering to them and all they have endured. Matt loved them so much that he jumped full tilt into active duty to serve his country. Matt and his wife Sarah have been married 20 years, and they're the parents of four children, one of whom has special needs. He's also a PhD and Doctor of Ministry, and we are thrilled to welcome Matt to the podcast today. Thank you so much for joining us, Matt.
Matt McCraney:
Pleasure to be here. Thank you.
Stephanie Daniels:
Well, first off, I just wanna say thank you so much for your service to our country. We really appreciate you, and your fellow servicemen and women, so thank you.
Matt McCraney:
Thanks for your support. It's an honor to serve.
Stephanie Daniels:
Well, I love your heart and can't wait to get into this conversation today. So can we start by you just telling us what you do for the Army?
Matt McCraney:
Sure. So, I'm an army chaplain. What that basically means is I'm a pastor to soldiers. An army chaplain will do pretty much the same thing that your normal pastor is gonna do. We preach, we teach, we baptize, we do memorial ceremonies and services, funerals, weddings. But when soldiers deploy downrange or when they go to a lot of different places across the planet, they can't always bring their church with them. So, army chaplains, we go out with them.
One of the big differences between being a civilian pastor and being an army chaplain is that where my flock goes, that's where I go. So, if they're jumping out of a plane that day, then looks like I'm strapping a parachute on and jumping outta a plane. If they're doing a 12-mile ruck march, we're out there rucking with them. It's what we call embedded ministry. So, we'll go all over the place with them. We do all the same training, sleeping in the field with them. The only thing that we don't really do is we don't shoot weapons. We're non-combatants, and so we don't carry weapons. But we go and do pretty much everything else with them.
I've been on active duty for about 12 years now. The first 10 years or so was battalion ministry. I've been promoted and one of my main jobs is coach, teach, and mentor our junior chaplains. Help them to do the job better, deal with tricky ministry situations, things like that.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm. Embedded ministry. I'm stuck on that, and I feel like there's a message in there somewhere. What a needed role. I can only imagine everything that our soldiers are confronted with, your role is vital to what they do. So, oh, thank you so much for explaining that and thank you for doing it. So, I'm curious, what made you switch from pastoring in the church to pastoring in the Army as a chaplain?
Matt McCraney:
Yeah, so I was an associate pastor at Plymouth Haven Baptist Church in Alexandria, in Northern Virginia. Probably about half of our church were military. And I just fell in love with these military families and all that they were going through, being there with them as parents were deploying. Our senior pastor was a retired Navy Chaplain. So, I just caught that bug, you know, really enjoyed it and I jumped into the reserves.
I chose Army. Um, my dad and my grandfather were Army. And did it for about four years in the reserve, so that's one weekend, a month, two weeks in the summer. I was pastor in a church, a senior pastor up there, was really enjoying it. But my wife and I were prayerful about, maybe active duty is what we should try. Maybe we should do this for a few years. And so, we went in with the kind of expectation that, hey, we may only do three years, and we may do one trip tour and then get out. Now we're 12 years later and on active duty and we're heading to our fifth duty station. I think?
Stephanie Daniels:
What a journey you guys have been on. I'm thankful for your wife that she's, you know, so supportive of where you feel like...
Matt McCraney:
Me too!
Stephanie Daniels:
...the Lord has taken you. Right. And that brings us to talking about your family. I would love to hear about them and your son who lives with autism. Hearing about all that you've been through, I have even more questions about what it's like to do all the transitions, go through all of that with a son who might not be so hip to making frequent changes and that sort of thing. We can get to that, but let's start at the beginning. What was it like when you first got his diagnosis?
Matt McCraney:
Yeah, so, some mixed feelings actually. We'd suspected that something was not quite right. We had had speech therapy for several years. He had trouble with transitions. There were a lot of things that he didn't quite hit some of the normal markers for, and we suspected something was not right.
One day we were visiting family, and I think it was my stepmom, she said, you know, I, I wonder if he has autism. And it was like scales falling from the eyes. We started saying, well maybe this is it, maybe that's what's going on here. We started that process and it took about four to six months to get him diagnosed. It's a long process.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
It's interviews with multiple specialists. They interview the parents. They get feedback from teachers, friends, just anybody that has regular interactions to be able to diagnose what's going on. And when we finally got the news, it was kind of like a weight off our shoulders. Because we finally knew what we're dealing with. It also helped us because we could look back and say, okay, this is why this worked and this didn't work...
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
In, in our parenting, this is why he got frustrated in this situation and not this situation.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah, that's interesting. And how old was your son around this time?
Matt McCraney:
I think it was seven-eight timeframe.
Stephanie Daniels:
Okay. It's interesting 'cause I was reading in a book the other day about a little guy that had gotten diagnosed as well. And the mom's mother had caught it. She was the one that was saying, maybe you guys should get him tested. I'm sure that once you land on a diagnosis, it's like, okay. All right.
Matt McCraney:
Yeah. What's interesting is sometimes when you're so close to a problem, you can't see it objectively and it takes somebody outside of you. And of course, my stepmom lived hours and hours away. We usually would see 'em two, three times a year.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Matt McCraney:
So, there wasn't this regular interaction. And sometimes that outside perspective is like, oh...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
...she's seeing something we're not seeing. It can be very helpful.
Stephanie Daniels:
So, I'm also curious, Matt, as you guys have moved around, how has that affected your son?
Matt McCraney:
Well, the army life is hard. We move every two to three years and every single time that we move, it's uprooting not just our family, but our life. We change churches. We have to find new providers, new therapists, all of the people that pour into his life change every two to three years. Now, the good thing is, the military has a lot of great specialists and we've got really good healthcare. But those moves are pretty chaotic. Each time we move, he's two or three years older, he's in a different phase of life, he's dealing with different struggles. That can be its own kind of challenge.
As I mentioned, we're in the middle of a move. We have an empty house. All of our stuff has been moved to our next duty station and we're living in our house on air mattresses. The toys aren't there, the comfort things aren't there.
We had a service dog for him, and unfortunately our dog died in April of last year. Our service dog was great. He would cuddle on command. When my son would get upset, he would go over and he would kinda lay on him and give pressure to him and kinda lick him in the face, give kisses. And it really helped him to calm down. It was this big, fluffy dog too. Odie was his name.
Stephanie Daniels:
Aw.
Matt McCraney:
When we would be in church, he would lay down and put his head on Odie and it would help him stay calm and get through a long sermon. And he's been the consistent thing through so many PCS. PCS is permanent change of station. This is the first one that we've had without the service dog. So, there's changes each time, it can be a lot of work and bring a lot of anxiety. This is the time when we just have to lean on God and trust him that he's gonna get us through this. We know that this is gonna be a difficult time and our prayer is always that we will suffer well and that we will honor God, even as we face these difficulties.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah, wow. That is a lot, but I know the Lord will sustain you through all of that.
Matt, you have your PhD and when writing your dissertation, you focused on the social model of disability and how that impacts our thinking and views of disability. Can you explain the different models of disability for us?
Matt McCraney:
Sure. So, there's three basic models for understanding disability: the moral model, the medical model, and the social model. The moral model is the idea that disability is the result of an individual sin or their parent’s sin. If you think about John chapter nine, when the disciples say to Jesus, "Who sinned that this man was born blind, was it him or his parents?" And that was a very common way of thinking in the time. And the moral model has been actually one of the prominent models of understanding disability throughout history. It's still, actually around today, people still hold a moral understanding of disability
There's this book by Michael Bates, that he wrote with Joni Eareckson Tada, called Disability and the Gospel. Michael Bates's daughter is in a wheelchair and he talks about how people have come up to him in church and asked if he had repented of his sin that caused his daughter to be born with a disability. We've experienced some similar things. We've had people tell us we would always have problems with our son because my wife wasn't a stay-at-home mom for the first two years of his life.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
We've been told it's because we didn't trust God by our choice to have him vaccinated, and that's why he has a disability. We've been told it's a failure to parent, we should have just spanked him more, you know?
Stephanie Daniels:
Wow.
Matt McCraney:
And these are all moral understandings. It's looking for some sin in the person's life that would cause the disability. And I honestly think a lot of that comes from our own insecurities, right? When we see somebody that has a disability, there's a little bit of fear in us, like, "Wow, that that could be me, that could be my kid." And so, we kind of look for reason of why a person has disability and will, kind of go to some inappropriate places sometimes.
If you read a lot of disability studies and disability theologies, they'll talk a lot about how the moral model is one of the things that drives people with disabilities away from the church.
That's not the only model, of course. The medical model is an understanding that, it's really just about the body. What the person needs more than anything else is healing. So, we say medical and we tend to think doctors and all of that. But really, it's anybody that looks at a person with disabilities and say, what they really need is just to be healed.
I grew up in the church and we would have a prayer meeting and choir practice. We used to call it organ recital and choir practice. Right? Because all the prayer meeting was, was like, "We're praying for Aunt Ida kidneys, for Jim's high cholesterol, you know, God would heal them? Would you be with the doctors?" But we never prayed that Aunt Ida would honor God, she would suffer well, she would glorify God through her struggle that she's had.
Stephanie Daniels:
Right?
Matt McCraney:
It's all about just healing. When we stop and we think about that, you know if God healed my son today, his greatest need would still be Jesus. Healing would be great. We pray for it every day. But he would still need Jesus.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
There's a conference that Joni spoke at in 2013 and she talks about how people would come up to her and wanna pray for her healing. And she would always encourage, “Yeah, yeah that's great. But would you also pray for this?...” And she would talk about how she's kind of a workaholic...
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
...and sometimes she can be frustrated in the morning, and she can have this bad attitude. She said she just lists off these things…
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
…that need to be repented of and rooted out of her heart. And I think that that's just such a great, wonderful way of expressing it. We're more than just our bodies. We need more than just healing.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
The final one is the social model. And the idea with the social model is that the real pain from disability is social pain. That disability is socially constructed. So, it kind of splits out impairment from disability. And part of the problem with this is when we say that the real problem with disability is social pain, not physical pain. I can tell you, I know a lot of guys that have purple hearts that have been wounded in combat, that live in constant pain, and they would probably balk at the assumption that the social pain is worse than their physical pain.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
Disability is a real thing. People really do suffer in their body from disability. And it also leads to some places that aren't the greatest. There's a trend now of people who are autism influencers that have never been diagnosed with autism.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
They self-diagnose; they self-identify as autistic. It may seem harmless, but it actually is shaping the conversation on autism. NIH had a study that they put out, I think about a year ago where they looked at there are 11 and a half billion uses of the hashtag autism on social media. But the vast majority of them contain completely wrong information. Not just misinformation, not just misguided or unclear, just flat-out wrong information on autism.
And a lot of that is because the influencers, the drivers of the conversation, are some people that are just identifying as autistic. These are some of the issues. And when you look at the models of disability, how we choose to look at disability is gonna impact how we relate...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yes.
Matt McCraney:
...to people with disabilities. They create assumptions and biases, things that we bring into the interpersonal relationship. And if we want people with disabilities to feel welcome in our churches, we gotta check our own assumptions.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
We gotta do some self-reflection and we gotta fix the issue at the interpersonal level.
Stephanie Daniels:
As you're explaining these, I just was wondering like, how damaging are these different views that we can carry. And it's not, I guess it is damaging toward the families, because it's causing us to see them in a certain way that God doesn't intend us to assume these things. And I, wow. I'm convicted, because I think that there's some of these models have been the lens that I've looked through.
So, in light of that, let's talk about how we should respond to families that may look different from us on a Sunday morning. How can we as Christians ensure that we don't make negative assumptions about disability?
Matt McCraney:
I think a lot of it starts with the pastor and the leadership of local churches, and what they choose to focus on. The pulpit has some power to it when they emphasize welcoming of people with disabilities. When they avoid a transactional view of God. When they talk about suffering, in a really good, robust theology of suffering is what we really need to hear coming from pulpits and from teachers.
I love the book of Job, and it's really interesting, when you read that first chapter of Job, God, Satan, and Job all agree on one thing: Job is righteous. He is perfect. He is a sinless guy. There is no reason why he should suffer.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
But then he suffers this horrible, horrible suffering. Loses his family, physical pain that is just immense. And he doesn't sin until his friends come along and try to find the in particular ways that he had sinned. They actually egg him onto sin by them trying to find sin in his life. They torment him towards sin. That's a warning that we have to really think about. Pastors and teachers really need to take hard looks at ourselves to say, is this what we're doing? Are we teaching God correctly?
Stephanie Daniels:
Hmm.
Matt McCraney:
The other thing that I would say is, and again, I've said it a couple times, it really is about the interpersonal relationships. We move around every few years and we go be part of new churches and, it's always a struggle to find a good church that's welcoming to people with disabilities.
Now I'll tell you, I'm a Baptist. I got a PhD in D.Min. from like two Southern Baptists, and so I'm Baptist through and through. But we currently go to a PCA Church.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
The reason why is because they were the most welcoming to our son with disabilities. And so, there's certain things we have to think about that a lot of other Christians don't have to think about. We have to think about how they're going to receive our son. And so, a couple things with him with this church in particular that's been great, is that they have a separate area where we can watch the sermon and be part of the service. A nice couch, kind of out in the foyer. When my son's having a really hard time we can go sit out there.
But what actually is the most helpful thing for us is about halfway through the service, the choir dismisses and they come out grab their coffee but before going back in, a bunch of the members will stop and they'll sit and talk to us. They'll talk directly to my son, they'll talk to me, and it's just that personal engagement that keeps us from feeling isolated.
There's one deacon in particular, Chris, he always comes up to us and always engages with Timothy and super positive. When I'm traveling and sometimes my wife is by herself, trying to wrangle all the kids, plus Timothy, he'll come up and help and just talk to Timothy and it's such a blessing.
Interesting thing about Chris though, he's a pilot. A few years ago, he was in a plane crash and crushed his two feet. He was in a wheelchair for about a year. He had all kinds of therapy. What was interesting though, he loved singing in the choir. So, for about a year, that choir did not sit in the choir loft, they sat on the front row and they did that so Chris could still be part of the choir.
Stephanie Daniels:
Wow.
Matt McCraney:
And you got like 20 or 30 people in a choir accommodating so Chris could be part of the choir, even when he is in a wheelchair and then on crutches. So just that kind of love on the interpersonal one-on-one, we're not talking about a huge disability ministry, which I think are great, I think those ministries are great. It's that interpersonal kind of relationship.
Another church that we went to, I think my son would've been around nine years old at this point. After a sermon, he says, "Finally he's done" just super loud and the pastor, he just laughs and was like, "Yeah, you're right Timothy, I went a little long today." Yeah, just, just...
Stephanie Daniels:
I love that. I love that. You also shared a story about your son seeing a larger African American man and calling him the chocolate giant. I love that story. Can you explain a little bit of that?
Matt McCraney:
Yeah, so my wife had taken all the kids to the grocery store. My son probably would've been around, again six or seven years old, I think. And he sees this just really large African American man standing there with his wife and he looks up at him and says, "Wow, you're like a giant, a chocolate giant." My wife just was like, mortified that he would say this, but then thankfully him and his wife just started cracking up. We were so thankful. Because, you know, he had a tendency to say some of this stuff sometimes, and.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah, I think a lot of parents can relate to these kinds of stories though. And I think that this might be one of the things that keeps families from coming to church because they are like, you know, I don't know what my kid’s gonna say. I don't know when they're gonna say it or how they're gonna react. And so, I'm just thankful that you guys have found a church that has accepted you and embraced you, and you guys are getting fed. And what a beautiful picture that you shared with us about the gentleman who was the pilot and the choir accommodating him.
You know, that's what we're about here at Joni and Friends is everybody finding their place in the body of Christ, being able to serve. I think a lot of our leadership team has shared this, but we don't get a full picture of the glory of God until people are serving with various abilities. And so, what an encouraging and beautiful story that you've shared.
So Matt, you talked about how you guys have found this church that has embraced you. How do you and your family navigate changing churches when you relocate?
Matt McCraney:
That can be a pretty big challenge. For most people, I think when they look for a church, you want to look for, obviously do you have a church that's preaching the word of God? Good theologically, solid church, right? That's, that is first and foremost our concern always.
But we always have these sort of secondary concerns that we have to think through. And a lot of times we can't know until we go. Because there's certain things that you can't pick up on. You watch the services beforehand, but especially when you have a kid that has a sensory type of issue. Walk in the front door and it's vaulted ceilings and everybody's hanging out there and it's loud, right? It's just absolutely chaotic and loud. That unnerves my son.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
Or I love me some electric guitar and drums, but when they are blaring it is really hard...
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm.
Matt McCraney:
...if, you have sensory issues. So, there's certain things that are architectural that you wouldn't even think of that can be too much. It sounds shallow, right? There's an old joke as a pastor, "Well, I didn't join your church because of the color of your carpet." Well, that could be a legit issue. You've got sensory issues, right?
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. Aw.
Matt McCraney:
Um, you know certain colors, certain textures can cause problems if you have sensory sensibilities. So, there's all of these little things that you look for. So, it is always a challenge. It's always a hit or miss trial and error type of thing that we do.
So, it can take months going to the new places. And of course, each time we walk in the door, you know, they don't know that my son has autism. That's one of the challenges of having a kid with autism is there's no visual marker that there's a disability. But autism is a cognitive neurological disability. There's processing issues. His brain does not function the same way as most other people's brains function. But you won't know that...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
...until you actually get to know him. And then a lot of times if he has some a maladaptive event or something, or gets very upset, people look at us, it's like, "Oh, look at these bad parents. They're not disciplining their kid." So those are just a few of the challenges that we struggle with. And it's every time we move.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. It's making me think of one of the articles that you wrote. I really enjoyed reading Faith on the Spectrum. You kind of give a breakdown of the things that kids with ASD might be experiencing. I loved reading that portion, and then getting into discipling these kiddos. And I wanna get into that a little bit as well.
Matt McCraney:
Yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
Why it's important to disciple these kids with ASD.
Matt McCraney:
So, Faith on the Spectrum was published here a few months ago in the D6 Family Ministry Journal, and you could just Google D6 Family Ministry Journal and it's available there. And discipleship is so important, because like I said earlier, if my son was healed today, he would still need Jesus.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
Right? He, he still needs Jesus. It's not just about the healing. But when we look at discipleship for somebody on the spectrum, we have to start with an understanding: it's gonna look different. It's not gonna look the same way as discipleship to a neurotypical child.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
And some of the things that we use in children's ministries for discipleship can actually be counterproductive for the person that's on the spectrum. So, an example, competition games, some kids on the spectrum just cannot handle competitions. It's something that's very difficult for them. Also, Scripture memorizations. We tend to do this thing where, "Oh, memorize enough Scripture and you get a reward." Well, for the kid that has a cognitive processing issue, it's hard for them to remember and memorize these types of things.
One of the stereotypes about autism is this hyper focus. And it's true, kids on the spectrum tend to have a hyperfocus on something. So sometimes people assume that, oh, that means they should be really good at scripture memorization, and it doesn't work that way.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
They most often don't have a control over what they hyperfocus on. So, discipleship is gonna look different. And then if we're not being sensitive and we're comparing the kid on the spectrum with the neurotypical kid, it's gonna lead to disappointment for both the person that's doing the discipling and for the individual with autism, because they're not gonna see that result. It's not gonna look the same way.
The key thing is teaching them to follow after Jesus. I think I used this example in the article. When you look at the story of the widow's might, what on earth does that have to do with autism? The story is, you know, Jesus points to the woman you know, she puts in two pennies in the offering, and he says she gave more than everybody else out here.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
Because she gave in her poverty when they gave out of their wealth, right. When you look at what it takes for kid on the spectrum to respond positively to somebody, to, to respond in a loving way versus a combative way, it's a lot harder for that kid to make that little step of sanctification than it is for that neurotypical kid. And so, one way you can look at it is that's a negative thing, but you can also look at it as a positive.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
Right? I mean, this is such a huge gift, this huge step that this child made because they were able to respond in a loving manner and forgiveness to somebody who's wronged them or yelled at them. So those little wins really aren't as little as we think they are, they're actually huge.
Stephanie Daniels:
Wow. I love that you pointed that out. That's really beautiful. I can think back to a family that was attending our Family Retreats in Texas and they have a son, he's on the spectrum, and they've had to put him in a home for a season, and he'll come back to their home for visits and I've seen them really praise him for the small wins, the small victories.
Matt McCraney:
Yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
When he's really having a difficult time with something. And so, I love that you shared that. Thank you for explaining the importance of discipleship and how that can look different.
As a dad of a child with a disability, I know it hasn't been easy for you, and you shared some stories earlier and you wrote another fantastic, transparent article about why disabled families are absent from church. How can we, as the church body, better understand the unique struggles of families with disability and the autism spectrum disorder?
Matt McCraney:
Yeah. I think I titled that one, "I Hate Sundays."
Stephanie Daniels:
I loved that article.
Matt McCraney:
I, it sounds weird right here's the chaplain the pastor for like 20 odd years here who's like, "I hate Sundays." But on Sunday mornings, I, I think that it would be really helpful for folks to understand what a Sunday morning really looks like when you're impacted by disability and in general and, but also autism specifically.
Consistency is really important for kids on the spectrum, right? Having a schedule, doing the same things.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
Right? So, Sunday is a break, it's unlike anything we do throughout the rest of the week. It starts at a different time, it has all kinds of social expectations of things that you're supposed to do, certain ways that you're supposed to act, certain ways that you're supposed to dress. Every church in America today says, "Oh, just come as you are," but most churches are not just come as you are. Like, let's be honest, right? There's an expectation.
So, all of these things are like a struggle just getting into the door. And then you walk through the door, and it's loud and you know that we're gonna sit there for a 45 minute sermon and it's get up, sit down, get up, sit down, Simon-says throughout the entire service. And we sometimes think, "Oh, well, you should just be able to handle this." And it's like, well, if you struggle with ASD, it's a lot harder than you actually think it is.
I like to give the example if something's loud for us, if we're neurotypical, we can just kinda like step away from it, we can kind of ignore it. But things that are loud for them, it feels like a speaker two inches from their ears and it's grating on them. The seams on our clothes, you see a lot of kids with autism that wear their clothes inside out. And it's 'cause those seams, they feel every seam on their clothes, and it drives them nuts. So, we have to understand these unique things that they are dealing with when they walk through the door.
And then for the family members, most of my Sunday is gonna be attached to my son's hip. I'm gonna be with him everywhere he goes. I'm, gonna try to calm him down if he's getting upset about something. If something doesn't go his way or something said that upsets him or he hears something or it's too loud, whatever is going on in his world to try to keep him from having a bad day, setting the day on fire.
And so, realizing that, that's really isolating for me. That's isolating for family members when we're really just trying to keep it together. We need to have the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ poured out on us on a Sunday morning...
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
...just like everybody else does.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
But we're so caught up in taking care of our children that it gets, it gets very difficult. I have some good friends who don't go to church anymore. Not because they don't believe, not because they lack faith, it's because Sundays have become too hard with their disabled child. And sometimes what they'll do is they'll alternate weeks. One week one parent will go, and the other will stay home with their child. They're never in church together, and the children don't come to church.
Those are the kind of things that we really need to change within the church. Not only that we're more welcoming, but we're taking a kind of a look at ourselves and our own expectations and trying to get rid of some of this stuff that we have that's cultural assumptions about the way that people should look or act. I think I mentioned this a little bit earlier, we have sort of a prosperity gospel that's in our churches when it comes to parenting.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
Right? If I just do everything right, my kid is gonna come out great. All the Christian parenting methods that are out there, it's like if you bring them up in the way of the Lord, they're gonna walk with God. And if you look through the Bible, it just doesn't seem to work like that. Because the best people, the most righteous people seem to have awful kids. And then you find people that are just absolutely awful, have wonderful kids.
Stephanie Daniels:
Mm-hmm.
Matt McCraney:
You know, especially reading through the list of the kings in the Old Testament. So, you can do everything right as a parent, and, and your child not come out the way that you want them to. And you can do everything wrong in they come out wonderful. But we buy this prosperity Gospel. so when we look at people whose lives don't look the same, or you look at somebody that has autism, it's easy sometimes to assume that maybe they did something wrong. And the more we make those assumptions, the more we push them away. There are people that absolutely need to hear the Gospel every single week.
Stephanie Daniels:
So how can we support families with disabilities, especially in our churches?
Matt McCraney:
I think that one of the biggest things, one of the most important things that we can do is just engage with them. Go up and start talking. Like I said, when we walk into the church, no one knows that we have a child with autism, but you're gonna find out pretty quick. It's gonna become obvious. One of the best things that you can do is just go up and start talking, and talk with a loving, nonjudgmental attitude.
Matt McCraney:
And as you get to know the person, ask how you can help. Tell me what your life is like and listen. Just engage.
You know, we talk about autism and the stereotypes out there, and I think that what gets lost a lot of times with autism is that about 25% of people with autism have known as profound autism. That's where they are nonverbal, or their IQ is lower than 50. There's a lot of folks out there that have this profound autism. And for them you're talking about really unique challenges to where they can't speak, toileting is an issue, motor skills, they physically can't, walk into a church as a family sometimes. So maybe what church looks like for them, is gonna be different. Maybe it's the pastor coming over with another family to the house on a Sunday afternoon and doing a short worship service with that family. I'm not saying we need a home church.
Stephanie Daniels:
Sure, sure.
Matt McCraney:
That's not what I'm getting at, but to meet that fellowship need. Find a willing family or two...
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
...to, to come. And it doesn't have to be a long service. It can be something really as simple as the pastor coming over in the afternoon, bringing those two families, doing a five-minute sermon, maybe singing a song, praying with the family, doing a mini worship service right there, so at least they can be part of it together.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
And it's a safe environment for this kid.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
Right. There's a lot of people out there that were not reaching that really need this.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. You know that's making me recall a podcast that we did last season with my coworker Mary Grace, who her husband is a Veteran, and he is living with the results of a traumatic brain injury from his service. Going to church for them is hard because the lights, the loud things can trigger seizures which are detrimental for him. And so, we talked about people from the church coming to visit. And so, I just love that you are sharing practical things that churches can do, small groups could do, or a pastor and like you said, another family, the worship leader. And I know that would take extra time, but also, it's for the Lord, you know, but...
Matt McCraney:
Yeah.
Stephanie Daniels:
...that is a beautiful way to be the hands and feet of Jesus to go encourage a family. So, I love that you brought that to light.
So, when your world is upended by a diagnosis, the furthest thing from your mind might be how God can be glorified through your hardship. But we know he is even in our grief and fear. And so, I'm curious, how would you encourage a parent wrestling with a new diagnosis?
Matt McCraney:
Where my mind goes to is Ephesians 2:10. It's this wonderful passage where we're told that, we are God's workmanship. That God has prepared good works for us in Christ Jesus to do. And there's a lot of encouragement here when we realize that the good works that God has given you to do right now is to minister to this child with this new diagnosis. The ministry that you'll do with this child taking care of your child is just as valid as being a church planter. It's just as valid as running that small group. It's just as valid as pastoring a church. This is a calling that God has placed on your life.
And as hard as it is, I think to accept sometimes, we need to understand that God is the Lord of disability. God chose disability for my son, and he chose me and my wife to be his parents. God, before the creation of the world set aside this good work for you to do. It's gonna be hard. You're gonna be stressed. You're gonna have times of frustration where things are not gonna go your way, but take heart because God is with you through this, and these good works that you do, the everyday things, the ordinary things that you do are a valid ministry and they bring glory to God.
Stephanie Daniels:
That is so beautiful and so encouraging, to know that we have been equipped. And I love that from the very beginning of time, he set that aside for you. He's equipped you for it. That is so encouraging. Thank you for sharing that.
In another one of your articles, More Than Bodies, I'm telling you, I really enjoyed reading your articles. But you referenced in your article More than Bodies that Jesus, when his reputation as a healer had already been established, Jesus centers on man's greater need. And you kind of addressed this earlier, but just wanna touch on this again. What is the greater need? Can you just explain that a little bit?
Matt McCraney:
Yeah. So, what I was referring to is this story in the gospels where four friends bring a man who is lame to Jesus. They break the law to get him there, right? They lower him down through the roof. And the scandalous thing that happens here is Jesus looks at this person, and the friends had clearly intended to drop him down there so that he could be healed. That was clearly what their desire was. But Jesus looks at him and says, "Your sins are forgiven."
And it causes this contrary, "How can he forgive sins?" but what Jesus is doing here is he is recognizing that this person's greatest need is not healing. That's the temporal thing. That's the thing, the here and the now, where we tend to think this is the most important thing that I need is to be healed.
Stephanie Daniels:
Right.
Matt McCraney:
And it, and it's, no, we need our sins forgiven. We need the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We need Christ living the perfect life and dying on a cross in our place and for our sins. That is what we need more than anything else.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah. That makes me think of something that Joni says a lot, you know, when people are praying for her healing, like we referenced earlier, she's like, “God healed me spiritually.” And it's gotten her to this place where she can really still pour out to people still believing for physical healing, but the spiritual healing has happened.
So, Matt, how would you encourage a family who's walking a similar road to yours? Maybe they're tired and frustrated waiting for a diagnosis, or they're in a challenging season with their disabled child, or maybe they're just drowning in a sea of caregiving, and they haven't been to church in a while. Would you share some encouragement with our listeners today?
Matt McCraney:
Yeah, listen. We need the body of Christ. Now, I know I've spent some time here, I, I've complained a little bit about how the way that, we treat people with disabilities in the Church. But we so need the body of Christ. We need the fellowship. We need our brothers and sisters in Christ to come alongside us, to encourage us. We need to hear the good news of the Gospel preached every single day. We really need to go hear it on Sundays. We need to take the Lord's Supper. We need to be involved with other brothers and sisters in Christ.
So as much as it is painful, as much as it is work, as much as it can sometimes hurt, and we've been hurt by church folks before, we need it. It's something we can't live without. We need that fellowship with other believers. So, I, I would've just encourage them, go. And I, if it becomes just a difficult situation, there's a lot of churches out there, right?
Stephanie Daniels:
Right.
Matt McCraney:
But don't give up going.
Stephanie Daniels:
Yeah.
Matt McCraney:
Don't give up going, force yourself to go. 'Cause we're gonna be better for it. And you never know how much your children are hearing.
Stephanie Daniels:
Hmm. That's so good. Yeah. The body of Christ, we need each other. That's great encouragement and I pray that our listeners will say, you know what, yeah we need to get back in the house, to be in that atmosphere under the anointing, under the Word, and just being challenged and strengthened as well by what they hear.
Matt, this has been a really, really beautiful conversation. It's been eye-opening for me, and I know, I'm sure it has for a lot of our listeners, been the same as well. So, thank you so much for joining us today on the podcast and bringing your insight and wisdom and encouragement to the table. I believe that we're all better for it.
Matt McCraney:
Well, thank you. It's been a pleasure and an honor to be here.
Stephanie Daniels:
I also wanna encourage and urge all of our listeners today to go and read Matt's articles on the Biblical Counseling Coalition website, and you also mentioned the D6 website. We've also linked them here in our show notes. I know that these articles, they were a blessing to me, they're profound and thought-provoking. I believe that they'll challenge some of the thoughts that we all have surrounding disability and help us change our approach to serving families in these same seasons of life.
We hope this conversation touched your heart today. If it did, consider sharing it with someone who might be encouraged as well. And don’t forget to follow us on your favorite podcasting app so you never miss an episode. See you next week!
© Joni and Friends